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Microsoft sticking with ATI for next Xbox GPU?

Posted Oct 14, 2009 at 12:09PM EST by Karl B.

Listed in: Xbox 360 Tags: ATI, GPU, Microsoft, xbox 360 titles

Xbox 360 - Image 1

Microsoft and ATI are reportedly partnering up once again for the next Xbox's GPU. Word has it that Microsoft is satisfied with the Xenos GPU found in Xbox 360s so we can expect another ATI GPU in the console's next iteration.

Tech site Fudzilla reports that the next generation Xbox should be around by 2012, which according to them leads to the possibility that the GPU will be a 28nm part. The new GPU will also reportedly support backwards compatibility.

The site also suggests that the new console was supposedly scheduled for a 2010 release but was pushed back due to the recession.

Via Fudzilla

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But wouldn't Microsoft essentially be using AMD made hardware while actively sponsoring and involving Intel in every project it ever does. But with nVidia hating Intel. Wouldn't AMD.....errrrr.....dominate the market? Wouldn't that have a detrimental effect on Intel hardware sales. nVidia is covered by PS3 but Intel isn't involved in the console market at all.

As AMD is basically ATi and ATi is AMD.

And also if the PlayStation always go for the POWER! route. For PS4, i expect a console which can hover or even fly.

# ? Intel hates nVidia — phiyuku 2009-10-14 15:39

Never knew that since I always though Intel fans are nVidia fans while ATI fans are AMD fans mainly since ATI and AMD are basically the same company. Me? I'm an Intel nVidia Fan.

# Nothing to do with what fans may or may not like — avatar76 2009-10-14 16:27

ATI is wholy owned by AMD, AMD makes competing CPUs to Intel's CPUs. Hence ATI (AMD) hates Intel.

I thought he'd explained that quite well.

# sorry clicked submit a bit early — avatar76 2009-10-14 16:33

nVidia don't hate intel so much as Microsoft and nVidia hate each other.

Due to the scuffle over the xbox1. MS were paying nVidia the same price per GPU as launch day for 5 year old technology at the end of the xbox1's reign. So they were losing huge money on every xbox sold.

# I'd p!ss my pants for some new hardware :) — avatar76 2009-10-14 16:45

Not that their's anything wrong with the 360 but I think Naughty Dog have just raised the bar with Uncarted 2 a little beyond what maybe the 360 is capable of. I don't know maybe the 360 could do Uncharted 2 but it looks like a big game to fit on one 9gig DVD. I'd be interested to know how much room Uncharted 2 takes up on a bluray disc. I think next year would be the right time for M$ to go alright we give in, here's a new 360 with a BD drive and some more ram for bigger draw distances...

My wish list would also be faster GPU, intel nehamalehm or whatever based CPU with at least say 4? cores in it and a BD drive, well as long as it's read speed is as fast as the DVD drive in the 360... I would _not_ want to sacrifice read speed/seek time for more storage.

The CPU thing though... that could mean another shift in how the xbox works fundamentally, so maybe they'll have to continue with the ibm PPC based CPUs which would be a bit sad because intel have really made some big improvements with the core2 and i7 architecture.

Oh and I don't want this MF to cook itself like the Xenon 360, Falcon or better reliability.

# @ avatar76 — phiyuku 2009-10-14 17:40

"But with nVidia hating Intel." Yeah that's the line I was talking about and I don't think anywhere he put AMD hates Intel but it is kind of a given.

Please read carefully avatar76 :)

# 2012 lol — vizard00 2009-10-15 09:00

2012 so all xbox 360 life was problems

# @phiyuku — Bountyhunter53 2009-10-15 09:46

Intel hates nVidia because of a legal dispute. Intel basically doesn't want their new laptop chipsets (the i series) accompanied with the nVidia chipset. But as Intel's i series already has a memory controller built-in already for performance a external slower memory controller from nVidia isn't needed. And nVidia says that there contract states that there has to be a companion chipset.

Basically nVidia wants a cut and Intel isn't giving it.

# Basically..... — Bountyhunter53 2009-10-15 09:50

Basically you want a PS3?

# .... — Shatterdome 2009-10-15 14:43

I think Killzone already raised the bar beyond what 360 can do and Uncharted raised it a little bit more. To answer your question, naughty dog said in an interview that uncharted is filling a 25gb blu ray.

It will be interesting to see if MS decides to go with blu-ray, and pay Sony royalties. It is basically their only option, unless they try to develop their own proprietary storage medium....or go completely digital (which I doubt).

Also blu ray drives are plenty fast, a 2X is only slightly slower than the 12x dvdrom that is in the 360 (on average). There are now 8X brd's which are plenty fast enough for next gen.

Also, you can actually replace the blu-ray drive in the ps3 with a faster one. I havn't been able to talk to anyone that has done it to confirm if it actually helps with load times....but it's possible.

# @Bountyhunter — avatar76 2009-10-15 15:26

Not really just think that devs are going to run into more and more barriers with the storage thing, and a hardware refresh would be nice, though it's not really needed. The hardware that the 360 is running on was probably surpassed a couple of years ago by the PC world. The mutliplatform games are starting to look a bit old hat on the PS3 and 360 compared to the PC versions, that's the main driver for me for a hardware refresh.

# @Bountyhunter — avatar76 2009-10-15 15:29

Interesting... I wasn't aware of that angle, my thoughts were that M$ would go back to nVidia like needing a hole in the head.

# @Shatterdome — avatar76 2009-10-15 15:37

Interesting, that's pretty cool. I would be interested in someone swapping that out and getting it working. You don't think that sony would have their own proprietary firmware on the drive (similar to the 360) to read the BD games and make sure they're not pirated? I would think you would have to tinker with the firmware somewhat to allow it to read at a faster speed _and_ return all the correct answers to the PS3's antipiracy protocols.

I mean if sony are amicable to the idea that's fine but firmware tinkering has been the piracy archilles heel for the 360. Maybe Sony have a better method then relying on the drive firmware to return the correct answers to it's antipiracy challenges. I mean they let the HDD get swapped, but that's a different kettle of fish I suppose. Payed for digital content on the HDD is signed to the unique identifiers in the console and the online account anyway so there's a reduced risk of piracy there.

# What? — avatar76 2009-10-15 15:41

Even if that was true, do you realise that 2012 is 3 years away?

# BD Drive — avatar76 2009-10-15 15:49

The other reason I think that MS may be coming around to the idea of BD drives is because the Halo anime films coming out next year are rumoured to be coming out on bluray disc also (as well as DVD and digital distribution on xblive).

So yeah, halo being a MS owned franchise I'd say that if that comes out on bluray then we'll almost certainly see it in the next games console.

# Remember this — YAMI ANUBIS X 2009-10-15 19:16

If MS does use blu ray next gen, they will be forced to pay Sony, everytime they make a game or movie on Blu ray because SONY owns Blu ray. So really next gen will be a win/ win situation for Sony.

MS will have to pay Sony for blu ray. everytime they use it. Sony will be getting alot of money off of MS next gen.

Its true that Blu ray is Sonys brand and there is no way for MS to create there own Blu ray. Unless they pay Sony.

# Yeah but just because sony own doesn't mean that they can't use it — avatar76 2009-10-15 21:36

I'm sure every other bluray player manufacturer are having to do the same thing...

Unless MS do a nintendo and make their own optical disc format (ala gamecube), that didn't work out so well for them.

# @avatar76 — Bountyhunter53 2009-10-16 09:12

You do know the price of a blank Blu-ray disc and the Blu-Ray writer. The price for the pirate BD would be around 15-20quid, wouldn't hurt to wait a few weeks for the preowned version for the same.

Also PC hardware is different than console hardware. Using PC hardware in Consoles would mean cut price top of the range hardware for 400 dollars. Wouldn't console makers up the price?

Finally, PC games are always better than console versions. Because as the game is built on a PC it isn't going to be very hard to port. And consoles have their own specialities. e.g. PS3 and its processing power, Xbox with its GPU abilities and Wii with err.........I dunno.

Remember a computer is something that can be upgraded or modified for better FPS's but with a console your stuck at the same FPS as everyone else.

# @BountyHunter — avatar76 2009-10-18 16:06

Yeah but there's always that period where the consoles do something wonderful the GPUs in the PC world don't have yet, well there was for the 360 anyway...

The point I was trying to make is that at launch time the 360 looked better than anything the PC could do, but the PC market has long since caught up and surpassed it. Usually the consoles run for a couple of years at this point looking decidingly lack lustre to what the PCs are doing and then there's a hardware refresh of the consoles and the cycle starts over again. It was just an observation I have made over the last couple of months.

# My guess is that there's no pressure from devs at the present time — avatar76 2009-10-18 16:17

For more GPU/CPU hardware at this point, which is a bit depressing really. I kind of like being amazed and excited about new hardware, controlers aren't really amazing me all that much at the moment...

My guess is they are asking for more RAM though hence the 1gig dev 360 for developers to load their "debugging" software into, so obviously that 512megs of RAM is starting to be a bit cramped. MS wouldn't have made a 1gig 360 dev model on a whim that would have to have been requested from a fairly prominent developer like Epic for example (which seems to be, MS' new Bungie this gen). I got to admit also Gears is generally more fun to play then halo3, although both gears games are definitely glitchier, in particular with the player model getting stuck in walls etc, I suspect it being third person shooted is a lot to do with that.

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