i hope yall 360 fans dident skip this part by mistake

Sony's PlayStation 3 was probably one of their favorites. Steve Ellis, director of Free Radical, said: Working on PS3 has allowed us to create vastly superior environments that verge on photo-realism – full-screen effects, High Dynamic Range (HDR) and obscenely complex shaders. It's more challenging than ever before, but the power is greater than anything else that’s out there.

lololol

lol i hope they didn't either.

...

Oh yea, by mistake. lol They didn't miss it but there probably ignoring it. :P

Wow...

PS3 receiving a compliment...has hell frozen over? But, it's nice to see the PS3 getting it's props. A system with great potential. Can't wait for this game. Co-op online story mode FTW!

Finally!!!

I had to re-read the part about how the producer loved working with the PS3 because it's vast superiority in the hardware department and i had do say FINALLY!!! a game creator with some balls to finally say the truth, the PS3 is superior and that they should take advantage of it's superior power. The point is that the PS3 is superior and these game companies shouldnt keep making games multiplatform and making them the same when they can triple the qaulity by focusing on what platfrom is the most powerful. All the XBOX 360 people can blab all they want, im gonna love when Blu-Ray beats out HD-dvd and they have to buy Blu-Ray players.......

hhhmmm

there's no sign of them anywhere...

A New War Begins

HAZElo

*Sigh* Don't you guys ever quit?

Free Radical's lead console last gen was the PS2, so it makes sense that the PS3 would be there lead console this gen. The comment regarding power is in relation to their PREVIOUS work LAST GEN, where it represents a huge leap in terms of power and therefore offers possibilities not available before. It is NOT a comment about the PS3 compared to the 360 or the PC with DX10 based graphics cards. Stop looking for what isn't there.

Oh and before you jump to reply

"but the power is greater than anything else that%u2019s out there" It is common knowledge from the beginning that the PS3 OVERALL is SLIGHTLY more powerful than the 360, since Cell can offer twice the floating-point power compared to Xenon and the 360 has a slightly better GPU. So yes, the PS3 is the most powerful console out there, we all know that, but it is not orders of magnitude better than the 360 as some like to believe, it is slightly better (when devs get to grips with the hardware). PC gamers of course will jump in and say the PC is even better, and they would be right, but I'm a console gamer with a limited budget. ;)

Really?

"I had to re-read the part about how the producer loved working with the PS3 because it's vast superiority in the hardware department" Then I suggest you clink on the link to the actual interview and read it again. He did not say the PS3 was vastly superior to other systems, he said the PS3 allowed vast improvements compared to last gen. To quote from the interview; "Q: How is it to develop on PS3? What can you do with this console that you couldn%u2019t do with previous-gen consoles? [SE]: It%u2019s great. Working on PS3 has allowed us to create vastly superior environments that verge on photorealism %u2013 full-screen effects, High Dynamic Range (HDR) and obscenely complex shaders. Its more challenging than ever before, but the power is greater than anything else that%u2019s out there." And there you have it. The reply is to the question of how the PS3 compares to last gen, not other consoles this gen, and even the last comment is NOT a statement that the PS3 is vastly superior to other consoles like the 360 (as I've said in another post above).

Uh huh

"The point is that the PS3 is superior and these game companies shouldnt keep making games multiplatform and making them the same when they can triple the qaulity by focusing on what platfrom is the most powerful" If you think a multi-format game would be VASTLY superior if it where a PS3 exclusive, then you really are dumb (sorry, but it's true). Last gen, the power gap between the PS2 and XBox was MUCH LARGER than that between the 360 and the PS3, and yet last gen, it was the XBox which saw the best version of multi-format games (thanks to the extra power), and XBox exclusives were not triple the quality of the best multi-format games. So if the power of the PS3 is what YOU think, then the PS3 should be getting better versions of multi-format games. The 360 can not pull down the quality of the PS3 version any more than the PS2 or GC could pull down the quality of XBox versions of multi-format games last gen. So the fact that they are so similar this gen is because the power between the 360 and PS3 is similar, not because the 360 is holding the PS3 back.

@LifeGuard77

Actually what he said is not dumb and maybe he just didn't explain it well. The problem with the PS3 is not the multiplatform, it's the 360 ports. Yes they have about the same power overall but their power is not similar. PS3 has a CPU advantage (more physics, hugest environments, more AI... all this potentially of course) while the 360 has a GPU advantage (anything but mostly graphics). So when a 360 game comes to PS3 it loses its graphical advantage because of less RAM available for graphics while it does not take advantage of the CPU. Let's not even imagine what would happen to a PS3 game ported to the 360... That's why exclusives are better for both systems. Oh and to your first post, I assume that they are aware that the 360 is out there, and they are working on it for a version of Haze. So I'm sure the 360 is included in the "out there". He's not saying the PS3 is BETTER, just more powerful, and we all knew that. And finally, it was surely cheaper for devs to remake games for each specfic console last gen than this gen. So this time, they will just do it on OpenSource Engine and work from there. So your GC-PS2-Xbox/PS3-360 comparison is just not fair.

Too many assumptions

"Actually what he said is not dumb" I see, so a game PS3 exclusive instead of multiformat having triple the quality is not dumb? Expecting devs not to make money by stop making multiformat and focus on the PS3 instead for a SLIGHT improvement is not dumb? R-i-g-h-t "The problem with the PS3 is not the multiplatform, it's the 360 ports" What 360 ports are those? The problem with too many gamers only is that they assume EVERYTHING is a port if it multiformat, which is WRONG. If a game is written for and optimised for one console and THEN brought over to another, then THAT'S a PORT, and often the game suffers as a result. A game in developement for multiple systems simultaneously is NOT a port. Yes, the lead format should benefit more, but that doesn't cripple the other formats. So this notion that the PS3 is suffering due to 360 ports is rubbish. "PS3 has a CPU advantage (more physics, hugest environments, more AI... all this potentially of course) while the 360 has a GPU advantage (anything but mostly graphics)." This is where it's not black and white. The Cell processor has a floating-ponit advantage, however Xenon has a general code advantage, and game code is a combination of both. Hence the size of the environment is not determined by fp arithmetic alone, but also by game code, the memory available, the strength of the GPU etc. AI logic also has little to do with fp arithmetic, it's mostly decision trees (if-then-else), but it's intergration with the environment will require fp, such as line of sight for each character (something which caused major problems for the devs working on Killzone for the PS2). Even with graphics, whilst the 360 GPU has an advantage, there will be certain techniques which are more suited to the PS3's GPU, despite less memory. So like I said, it's not black and white, there are many factors which determine the strengths and weaknesses of each console, and overall, both consoles are roughly evenly matched. "So when a 360 game comes to PS3 it loses its graphical advantage because of less RAM available for graphics while it does not take advantage of the CPU." Again, you're making the assumption that all the PS3 gets are ports, but this is not correct for multi-format games. Just because the 360 is the lead format in many cases is irrelevent, games like Haze have the PS3 as the lead format, but that doesn't make the 360 and PC versions ports, even if they are released months after the PS3 version. "Let's not even imagine what would happen to a PS3 game ported to the 360..." And why not, the 360 will be more than able to do the game justice. "That's why exclusives are better for both systems" I'm not against exclusives, I'm against the idea that being exclusive automatically results in a better game and that devs should avoid one massive user base just to satisfy another and lose potential profits as a result. IMO, it's selfish rather than practical to want/expect this to happen. "He's not saying the PS3 is BETTER, just more powerful, and we all knew that." Didn't you read my second post? "it was surely cheaper for devs to remake games for each specfic console last gen than this gen." Again, you're going on the idea of ports. Multi-format games which become so because of a game which was later brought to another console is NOT the same as a game in developement at the same time for multiple systems. I'm talking about the later, not the former. "So your GC-PS2-Xbox/PS3-360 comparison is just not fair" Of course it's fair. The comparison is about the quality seen in games across multiple systems when developed for multiple systems, it's not about ports (which are often handled by DIFFERENT devs and can often be VERY bad), and it's not about the cost of developement. What isn't fair is blaming the 360 for PS3 games which haven't met certain gamers overly high expectations. What isn't fair is calling the devs lazy because they haven't pushed the PS3 as far as some would like. What isn't fair

"What isn't fair" rant continued... ;)

... What isn't fair is blaming the 360 for PS3 games which haven't met certain gamers overly high expectations. What isn't fair is calling the devs lazy because they haven't pushed the PS3 as far as some would like. What isn't fair is calling devs greedy for wanting to make as much profit out of their games in an environment of increasingly expensive games! Don't get me wrong, I think the PS3 is a brilliant console, but it irritates me to see gamers who blame everything they don't like about PS3 games on developers, companies and other consoles instead of facing the facts that like the 360, the PS3 is a console which is not perfect and therefore devs have to work with what they have and what they know, and if the results are not as good as expected, so be it, that's life. :)

Well said

"it irritates me to see gamers who blame everything they don't like about PS3 games on developers, companies and other consoles instead of facing the facts that like the 360, the PS3 is a console which is not perfect and therefore devs have to work with what they have and what they know, and if the results are not as good as expected, so be it, that's life. :)" I agree with everything you've said but.... could you make you posts a little shorter next time. :D ;)

@ Gamer

"I agree with everything you've said but.... could you make you posts a little shorter next time. :D" LOL! Thanks. Yeah I'll try to keep it short in future. I was at work, didn't have much to do (the calm before the storm), and had time to waffle on earlier. :)

@LifeGuard

While I do agree with some of your points, I still can't help but think you are just another typical blind 360 fanboy who will stop at nothing to defend MS. Pathetic.

@BruceLeroy

While I cant help think you are a typical blind PS3 fanboy who will stop at nothing to attack MS or others who disagree. Utterly Pathetic.

@BruceLeroy

LOL that was f'n funnie on the last part of ur statement.

Oh my

@BruceLeroy- Then do point out what you see as my fanboy comments above! Point out where I'm wrong in my so-called 'defence' of MS! Whenever I get a responce like yours despite saying nothing bad against the PS3 (only stating the facts giving the fanboy post from 'The PS3 Factionist' which I was responding to), I can only assume your reaction is that of an overly sensitive PS3 fanboy who sees ANYTHING said in favour of MS or the 360 as signs of someone being a fanboy. Now THAT is what I call pathetic. @bobby- LOL! Agreed.

Whoa there, now where did that come from Bruce?

"I still can't help but think you are just another typical blind 360 fanboy who will stop at nothing to defend MS. Pathetic." With all due respect BruceLeroy, nothing Lifeguard has said is what you get from a "typical blind 360 fanboy". What was blind about the statements he made, and how was it pro MS/360 and anti Sony/PS3? Do you even know what a fanboy is? The most you could say about Lifeguard is that he 'may' be biased towards the 360, but having a bias doesn't make someone a fanboy. If he demonstrated a hatred toward the PS3, then yes you could say he's a fanboy. But does he in any of the posts above? No! I would also say that although I requested he kept his posts shorter, it does makes a change to read comments from someone who can put his views across intelligently rather than the usual ***** we have to read all the time from fanboys on ALL sides. Perhaps there's an elements of truth in bobby's response. :|

wtf!!!

who the hell is this lifeguard!!! he just ruined a good article to have discussions about with all that blubbering!!!! one swift scroll down the page and it's a freakin turnoff!!!! and just reading his first post alone you know where this guy is at!!! "The comment regarding power is in relation to their PREVIOUS work LAST GEN, where it represents a huge leap in terms of power and therefore offers possibilities not available before. It is NOT a comment about the PS3 compared to the 360 or the PC with DX10 based graphics cards." wtf!!!! the guy said "Working on PS3 has allowed us to create vastly superior environments that verge on photo-realism – full-screen effects, High Dynamic Range (HDR) and obscenely complex shaders. It's more challenging than ever before, but the power is greater than anything else that’s out there." oh i'm sure the 360 is part of that which is "out there"... but then he goes on being defensive again!!! and his first post alone nullifies any sense that might be in any of his freakin rant cause it's pretty clear from the get go this guy is just another one sided MS supporter ranting.

Try opening your eyes a little

"oh i'm sure the 360 is part of that which is "out there"... " He acknowledge that. He actually clarifies this STRAIGHT AWAY in his NEXT post (you know, the one directly below his first post!!! Didn't you read it?). READ IT, then return. So, you were saying? And why have you no problems with the posts which immediately take it to mean the PS3 is vastly more superior to the 360? How are these posts not ruining the article? (including the FIRST post in this thread!).

Oh wait, you were there!

And yet you had no problems with the FIRST post here pointing to 360 FANS (instead of fanboys btw) and happily quoting the paragraph as if it's something to boast about. IMO, that's explains your post here and says a lot about you. :|

Sorry, but you're a hypocrit Quixand

"he just ruined a good article to have discussions about with all that blubbering" As Gamer shows, you had no objection with the post which started this thread with the purpose of starting arguements and NOT discussing the article (which you haven't bothered to do yourself). The first post is not about the article, it's about having a fanboy fight, and you were more than happy to go on look out duty with your response "hhhmmm, there's no sign of them anywhere...". So please cut the cr@p about wanting an interesting discussion when you yourself were part of the process of drawing fanboys in! And as for my first post, the point I was making was that Steve's PS3 comments were in relation to LAST gen, since that was the question he was asked (read the interview). Only the very last part refers to today's machines, but even then, it was more of a throw away comment about the PS3 in general, where he stated what we already know. Despite this, some here claim he is actually saying the PS3 is VASTLY more powerful than the 360, which is FALSE. Hence my second post because I knew people will read my reply in relation to the LAST part of Steve's reply ONLY and ignore what the rest was about (as you've done yourself).

...

@LifeGuard The fact that you had to write a whole thesis arguing what one developer at Free Radical said leads me to believe you are more than just "biased" and are indeed a fanboy. What Steve Ellis said about the power of the PS3 is his opinion. I just find it funny that you had to make back to back to back posts just to prove otherwise. And as for me, yes I'm biased as well. But I also own a 360 and a Wii. I have Gears and GRAW2, both decent games. My Wii is collecting dust. Can't remember the last time I powered that thing up. So to all of you, please just STFU. Who cares which system is "more powerful." They all have advantages and disadvantages. Personally I could care less and I do not need to bash another system to make myself feel better. As for you bobby....go ***** yourself. Pathetic and sad little boy

Er this is LifeGuard right?

Why have you posted as me?

wtf!

"Why have you posted as me?" Gamer I'm really sorry, I was going to reply to you, then decided to reply to you and Quixand as a last post, then before finishing I clicked on another reply box above and lost my original unfinished reply to you both (I didn't realise you could only have one box open), so I came back and quickly made this reply but it's in the wrong place with your name pasted into the name instead of the subject (lucky I didn't put Quixand ;))... so let's just say it's a bit of a mess (serves me right for trying to post one last long post to you both :)). Anyway, I've said all I have to say to Quixand, hence thanks for the support Gamer. :)

@BruceLeroy

>"The fact that you had to write a whole thesis arguing what one developer at Free Radical said leads me to believe you are more than just "biased" and are indeed a fanboy" Think what you like, but as I said, point out where I was wrong, in otherwords there's the saying "Put up or shut up". ;) I admit my point was probably lost in the amount I wrote and the way I wrote (hence Gamer request I made them shorter), but that doesn't mean I was wrong BruceLeroy and it doesn't make me a fanboy, because if you took the time to read my comments you will see that I have NO problem with Free Radical's view of the PS3 and next-gen consoles. >"What Steve Ellis said about the power of the PS3 is his opinion." And where have I disputed that? I am in TOTAL AGREEMENT with Steve Ellis' opinion on the PS3, so I fail to see your problem with what I've said. My issue is with those who have taken Steve's word and TWISTED them to mean something he didn't say! Something fanboys do all the time. >"I just find it funny that you had to make back to back to back posts just to prove otherwise." Again, I have done nothing of the sort. Back to back, yes, to prove otherwise, no, because if you READ my posts for what they say rather than what you ASSUME they say, you would see I agree with Steve's comments completely. >"And as for me, yes I'm biased as well. But I also own a 360 and a Wii. I have Gears and GRAW2, both decent games. My Wii is collecting dust." Well, that's more than me, because I don;t have a next-gen console. So what does that make me then? ;) >"Who cares which system is "more powerful." They all have advantages and disadvantages. Personally I could care less and I do not need to bash another system to make myself feel better." Agreed, but I also see nothing wrong in discussing the pros and cons of next-gen consoles, even if others don't like what they read. :|

See, I told you so! :P

"I admit my point was probably lost in the amount I wrote and the way I wrote" Keep them short next time and I'm sure you'll get your point across much better (but I understood them just the same) :) Your points can be summarised as follows I believe; --- There are those here who think Steve Ellis is saying the PS3 is vastly more powerful than any other system out there, but he doesn't say this, he only says it's more powerful (which is a big difference) and we already knew this anyway. Also, his description of what they're doing on the PS3 (HDR, superior environments etc) was in relation to consoles from last gen, not the 360 or PC. --- This is what I agree with 100%

Freakin Novelettes!

WTF! I really like reading but these posts are ridiculous. KISS! Keep it simple, stupid! You lose most of the fanboys in the first paragraph so why make your posts so long?

Every1

i think you should all look at wikipedia's spec's on the ps3 & xbox 360 GPU's. Because from what i see the 360's gpu isn't better/more powerful at all. Then look at the artices on the CPS's. Seems like ps3 has other ways to use ram?

To Quixand

Hi Quixand, Your earlier posts used to be a little more rational. However, your rant against the (IMO completely rational and well-written) comments by LifeGuard kind of destroy your image of not being a fanboy. I own both a PS3 (purchased Feb 2007) and 360 (purchased Mar 2006), so I would say that I'm in a position where both consoles are dear to me (although I admit to having a slight bias in favour of the PS3 - this might have something to do with its being the underdog this time around). I would say that nowhere has LifeGuard actually tried to bash the PS3 (although I do detect an eagerness on his/her part to dampen any good news about the PS3, although this might have nothing to with any console - maybe he/she is just argumentative :) ). Anyway, stay cool mate, and don't let your love for any console get the better of your judgement. :) Regards, MTK

Don't be fooled by looknig at numbers alone.

The devs say the 360 GPU is slightly more powerful, and they should know. Specs don't give the full story, eg. the unified shader architecture of the 360 GPU makes it VERY efficient for performing shader operations (95% or so since shaders are not sitting idle). Traditional seperate vertex and pixel shaders in GPUs result in much lower levels of efficiency, resulting in levels of only around 60-70% efficiency, hence the move towards unified shaders for PC GPUs from both ATI and NVidia, especially under DX10. So on paper, the PS3 GPU may seem superior, but in reality, it's a different story. And when you take into account the embedded 10MB EDRAM within the 360's GPU (offering significant bandwidth savings and free...ish AA), then the GPU of the 360 does in fact have a slight advantage over RSX as stated by multi-format devs.

Agreed - Message to LifeGuard

I think LifeGuard's has made some really excellent points here. I've never seen him here before (assuming it's a he) and I could be wrong, but I think he must be new to QJ, since he made the mistake of making his posts way too long (and had to split one of them), he posted under my name in error, he posted in the wrong place, he didn't know you could only have one reply box open and lost his reply etc. Hopefully he returns because QJ needs a few more posters like him imo, whatever there bias may be. You're right though, he does seem argumentative, but I can forgive that when the person makes sense and puts their point across in an intelligent way (unlike fanboys). :) So welcome to QJ LifeGuard. Keep posting here and remember, try to keep it short in future. ;)

Thanks MTK

I thought I was the only person who understood what LifeGuard was saying. :)

Hi MTK

i don't think i said anything close to rational in this article but thanks man!!!! to lifeguard and gamer: none of the previous comments is anywhere like that of lifeguards!!!! go write a book man!!! and anyway, i go and take my 5 hours os sleep and wake up and go to work and check on QJ and you guys are still here ranting!!!! there is even a part where it was only the two of you conversing!!!! damn!!!

Whatever......

Everybody knows that it will be like this: HAZE > halo 2.5 errr 3 whatever....it's the same sh#t lol HAZE > halo "3" HAZE > halo "3" HAZE > halo "3" HAZE > halo "3"

Whatever 2. Your opinion only

Haze could be good, Haze could be cr-ap, I'd rather wait and see instead of relying on blind faith. The Halo series has already proved itself, and therefore Halo 3 is likely to be another excellent FPS. We'll have to wait and see if Haze could be the same.