RAD chief: piracy isn't killing us, used games are; denies 'new PSP game in the works' |
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After last week's media blitz of new games for the PSP - notwithstanding, PSP 2 rumors that sprung up from them - Ready At Dawn CEO Didier Malenfant gives us his bit of insight on the matter.Their studio, after all, was the subject of discussion when Sony's John Koller revealed that they're in talks with RAD to bring them back for PSP development.
Here's Malenfant's take on things - though he denies that they've been having talks with Sony for a new PSP game, he does agree with Koller on one thing: the whole digital distribution direction.
You know, the way these things work is that, ironically, even if there was a new PSP in the works we would probably be the last people to find out about it. I really have no clue what Sony's plans are.
As far as what my personal wishes are, I'd love to see anything that can help distribution move quicker toward a 100 percent online model. It's not piracy but used games that are killing us.
Despite them denying talks of making a new game for the PSP - never mind a new GoW game for the PSP - they're tipping their hats off to the other developers (Ubisoft for the new Assassin's Creed on the PSP, Activision for the new Rock Band: Unplugged, and the like) for having renewed interest in developing for the handheld.
Interesting to hear him speak about this on-going debate on piracy and used games. It gives us a new angle on the whole UMD-less argument being tossed around of late.
Discuss: QJ.NET General Gaming forum thread
Related articles:
- Sony wants Ready At Dawn back for new PSP game
- Rumor: Ready At Dawn's new GoW for PSP already in the works since 2008?
- Koller responds to UMD-less PSP 2 rumor: partially true, the rest is 'no comment'
- Rumor: PSP2 won't have UMD drive, says David Perry *UPDATE* PSP 2 is real, says Perry
- Atari: second hand game sales hurt industry, outlines plans to compensate
Via Edge
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Comments [refresh]
haven't given much thought about it until this article came up. i didn't even bother to think that used games can hurt their market.
Used games weren't killing you before and how could it be killing you now?
In all truth it probably is both used games and piracy cohesively killing the companies.
Person buys used game, person rips it, person uploads it, people download it = not a f'ing dime other than the original buyer who got 10-5% back for selling the game to a used game shop.
good to hear both sides though. nice info/news btw.
but there aren't as many people who pirate games as are people who buy used games. You're more liable to notice 5 friends of yours that pirate games than the 20 who don't, because the 5 stick out more. It really is the used games market. I haven't bought a new game in years, used ones are guaranteed to work and cheaper (at GameStop). Digital distribution may be the future sadly (I prefer to physically be able to hold my games..), but it's more risky, with all the connectivity between computers and consoles.. Look at the PC game market
I guess this is a big STFU to all the clueless folk that like to blame piracy for every ill under the sun.
Well said RAD
Lets take a second and define what "USED" means.
One person initially purchases it from a retailer. Then another person obtains the product from them instead of purchasing it from a retailer. What's not to stop a person in china ripping god of war, and reselling the data at an undefined fraction of the cost, with bandwidth being the currency?
Obviously, developer/producer of product (in this case, psp games) makes no profit on the second sale.
This intentionally broad ambiguous category obviously refers to used game sales as well as piracy.
Sony is trying to move their business model to 100% online, just like the iPhone. They even stated that 100% online is what they'd like to do. This way they can immediately & dynamically change their store at any given instant (patching an exploited game for example) and it requires the customers to give sony control of their psp when purchasing the products. (remember that ps store app for the pc, and how you HAVE to link the psp up to your pc with the usb cable, and not a mem card reader to install the demos/wallpapers/themes/etc)
Sony is just being nice and saying that it's just "used games.
I agree. This is bulls...
Used games haven't killed all other consoles. The DS would be dead by now if used games were so bad. I mean, how is it possible to destroy a cardridge? They practically maintain eternal.
PS2 was the most successful console ever. Games are still produced and used games for PS2 had a much bigger market.
the first part of your comment makes no sense to me.
you're saying the games on DS aren't easily destroyed, right?
that means there are more used games on the shelf!
if a game broke, you would have to buy a new one to replace the broken one (theoratically)
or by "used" do you miss-understand the meaning of it?
"used" as in "used to much, and broken"?
and if used PS2-gaes had a much bigger market than the actual one, then, shouldn't the companies lose money?
i know that the used market was VERY big, but if it was THAT big, we probably wouldn't have a PS3 now (even though PS3 was planned before PS2 was released!)
As a follow up, I dredged up this article from last year and linked to it in the post above.
Yes, Malenfant's claims about re-selling used games have a precedent. Atari spoke about it back in December.
http://pspupdates.qj.net/Atari-second-hand-games-hurt-industry/pg/49/aid/127003
There are estimated 5-8 % of all PSP users who would potentially be able to pirate games, because no more than 5-8 % have a custom firmware on their PSP (check Alek's blog for the proof).
So you've got 5%-8% potential pirates, and 92% - 95 % potential used games buyers.
See what I mean?
I think you missed the point - if only 5-8% of PSP units are capable of running ripped code, then clearly Piracy isn't the issue.
Take it from someone who works with people in the industry - developers only see a small fraction of the initial sale - publishers and retailers take the lion's share. On second user games, only the retailer makes any money.
Now consider the target audience, made up largely (though not exclusively) of teenagers and 20-somethings, who are price-conscious and internet savvy. They won't buy new unless it contains exlcusive content (Gears of War 2), some kind of pre-order exclusive (Luminous Arc 2) or is highly anticipated (SFIV).
Downloadable games kills any kind of second user market, potentially reduces the need for publishers and puts the majority of the profits in the developers hands. What developer is going to say no to that?
As an aside, if PSP2 is download only and region locked, I'm out. The vast majority of my PSP games are Japanese, and I have no intention of being restricted - if I only had access to EU PSP games, the console would have been binned years ago.
wish PS3 could do that ;)
because PS3 can do (almost) everything i need it to do... so i use it as my browser in the everyday-life ;)
but people typing links are just horrible (joking ^^), i can't copy-paste it on my PS3 :(
zzzzz.. here goes for a long, and tiresome write-off :(
well atleast that link is not like those anoying ones:
www.fish.net/6574?+98/500000000+?/wrong_error404php.?/n33D-_-v@c
that can piss me off
(just an example^^)
What the major companies need to start doing is controlling their sales through the "used" market as well. Which also makes me wonder about the rental stores, do they even get a fraction of the cost when a game is rented?
If you hate used games so much how about you release your game on the PSN ONLY. Oh wait... that will hurt you even more... cause very few people buy games off the PSN.
Seems to me like R@D is just moaning and trying to find a scapegoat. Getting rid of real physical copies will hurt the industry more than anything, that's a FACT.
In must countries rental stores are supposed to pay licensing fees to the publisher in order to be allowed to put their game up for rental. But there are MANY rental stores that don't do that...
Alek's blog is a very unreliable source LOL. He runs his mouth about many things.
that is true cuz not every1 has internet/wifi in their house
Gee, ever wonder what happens to a _premium_ priced game that has next to no replay value after an _extremely_ short 1player experience? It gets trade'n'played for something with more content. Go the digital download route on a secure system, every person who plays pays and has absolutely no resale value if the experience didn't add up to their expectations per dollar.
This sounds like a complete cop-out.
If used games are genuinely detrimental to the industry, why haven't they killed more systems? Why is it JUST the PSP that's constantly on a death watch?
This is complete bollocks. The PSP is being killed by poor marketing, not enough new games compared to other systems and an almost completely useless firmware division.
Ok.
This is what you do.
You give the media away for free.
Mail it out like AOL disks.
Then when the user logs into xbox live.
Offer then a license key locked to that xbox.
boom.
problem solved.
The media now has no worth.
No one will buy them again.
If your xbox dies.
You're as pooched as a TiVo.
First off. The PSP isn't dying as it's still out there, games are still being published, etc. They're not making as much money, but they're making money.
We have idiots saying. OMG, USED GAMES AREN'T MAKING OTHER SYSTEMS DIE LOLZZ. The PSP sells fairly well, so it's still making it, but how about other systems that aren't here. Used games as well as poor marketing could have been the cause.
Just because they're saying Piracy isn't the reason they're making less money and used games is? For systems like the Wii, 360, and PS3 where modded systems are few and far between, used games with places like Gamestop selling for only 5.00 less are killing the systems far more than piracy ever will. For DS piracy isn't so bad, and again used games is worse for the system. PSP has alot of piracy, but then again, used games do effect the sales of the system just like any other system.
Haven't you walked into a Gamestop and said you wanted to purchase a game. Every time they ask you if you'd rather buy a used copy instead for cheaper. At a Gamestop for 5.00 less it's not worth it, but there are some places you can get the games 20+ dollars less and even though it hurts the company, it's not *****ing you over as badly.
If you ask me. Gamestop is a parasite. Company is *****ty and I always buy new than EVER buy used from their due to the fact that you're just getting *****ed over by getting a scratched game for 5.00 less.
Rockband is EA, not activision....
If used game sales are hurting the industry so bad STOP CHARGING SO DAMN MUCH FOR THEM!
I usually buy new if a game is somewhat newer - if its years old it'll be next to impossible to step into an ebgames/gamestop and get a new copy and thus I buy used. That said, if a game is 2+ years old I expect it to be cheaper! The hell with paying $70!
With PS3 games hitting $70 (some are cheaper) and PSP games $40 and $50 - I just can't afford to get all the games I want at release day. If I head into my local ebgames and pre-order (or even just buy) 2 games for my PS3... I'm out roughtly $130!!!! $130!!! Thats insane!
I don't agree with the dumb $5 off a used game tho! If a game is being sold as used it had better be like 50% off.
You also have to think about other sites that host Dark_Alex's programs. Another thing that needs to be noted is that users who have a CFW on their psp will more than likely put a CFW on their friends using the stored files on their computer. I for one have put CFW's on my brothers psp as well as a couple of my friends.
and with the story qj posted yesterday
http://www.qj.net/Sony-to-PSP-devs-make-games-with-bigger-names-shorter-play-time/pg/49/aid/129224
are they trying to push their users away?
also, why would anyone want to wait for 1.8GB (possibly bigger for psp2) to download before they can play it.
not everyone has the internet let alone internet fast enough to make digital distribution viable.
also, whats stopping me from downloading the game to my memory stick, copying the memstick to another one and reselling the game at the price of the memstick and the game that resides on it.
to quote einstien on red alert 1
sooner or later, time will tell
69.99 a PS3 game and 49.99 for a PSP game?
Other than special edition copies, no PS3 or XBOX 360 has went over 59.99. There has been no PSP game for anymore than 39.99, most of which release for 29.99 and even a few(usually a Sony release) which starts at 19.99(Loco Roco/Loco Roco 2/Patapon.)
The only time I've seen a PSP game for 49.99 is at Walmart. Since everyone shops there, Walmart being the hypocritical *****s they are attempt to dupe people in that they're getting the lowest prices when half the stuff at Walmart is higher priced.
The problem is for every used game purchased companies don't make any money of it, only retailers. For most of you guys who don't know...Gamestop makes most of its profits from used games, I read in an article here in "qj" that Gamestop has over a billion dollars in profit from used games.
Companies only get money when new games are sold, retailers get money from both new games and used games, but the gain more profit from used games you may ask why? because they buy the game from you for half price or even lower than that, it's a little something called "Ripping you off", then reselling it to somebody else for almost the same price as a new game would sell for.
The only thing I find good about used games is just that it helps find games that are not in production anymore. Once digital download starts this ratailers are going down the sink...that is why used games are killing companies more than piracy, it's more of a large scale problem with used games.
come to australia if you want to see expensive
check out prices on COD and bioshock
http://www.ebgames.com.au/productSearch.cfm?category+2+platform+ps3+clear+
sick of guys like you whinging that games cost too much
$129.99 for A-grade titles is the norm and second hand you can up to $30 or $40
1. Theres no edit feature
2. That stupid thing where all your equals signs gets turned into plus signs, i mean really after all this time you'de think someone would of fixed that by now
edit from last post
$129.99 for A-grade titles is the norm and second hand you can SAVE up to $30 or $40
and put equals signs in the link where the plus signs are
In a sense, couldn't the whole "used games" thing be considered a type of piracy? At least to the developers..?
Because if you look at it this way, it kinda makes since..
If someone buys a new game, the dev. makes some dough. If that someone sells it to Gamestop or a friend, either way, the dev gets none of the extra money, and more people get to enjoy the game.
If Someone buys the game, again, the devs get some money. Then the someone uploads a ripped copy, then another someone downloads it, the dev STILL doesn't make any extra money, but more people get to enjoy the game again.
The problem with piracy is that it steals the money away from the software developer. Used games do it too, but in a more "legal" way.
Simple ways to fix the "used games" problem :
Make used game dealers send a percent to the devs (license),
Stop used games dealing,
Stop the production of hard copied games (online store, which also does no.2)
I love used games. Cause not every game out there is fantastic or within my taste to be purchased at release sale. Like for instance, Mirror Edge is probably a good game. I don't particularly like the FPV of the game. But I have rented it, and thought it was alright. From renting it, I conducted, it's a game that will mostly likely be something I'd buy pre-owned or something below 40 dollars. Preowned games help people buy games that looks alright, but not willing to shed 60 dollars for. No offense to anyone in the game industry or developers, but if you really dislike pre-owned games, then maybe it's time for you to make 'BETTER' games and not crappy ones like Haze(no offense since I liked playing it), where everyone has trashed it and sold it back to the stores.
Make games that actually is WORTH the price the first time. I mean sure, I've never sold my games when I buy them now(tried it once back in the genesis days, and it was a waste), but people wouldn't need to if the game was great and not overhyped pieces of crap. GTA4 has hit the new stage of overhyped and reselling it back to the stores. Now I'm not bashing Rockstar since I love the new direction more-so then the rehashing the same style of last gen, but it's apparent not everyone liked it, and then they sold it. While I love used games for my personal reasons, the only people to blame for use games in the first place are the lack of effort, time, and creativity of the developers. They're making the games, and it becoming used, it's the fault of them. This is just my opinion and how I see it, so i'm not trying to make anyone agree with me. But I think the devs need to take responsibility of their own actions and no try to save face with finding a scape goat. Prime example is Nintendo doing it with Wii Music when it's apparent it's a crappy, gimmicky title. I knew it was going to be this when I saw hordes of advertisements for the game.
The solution to use games is this: MAKE BETTER GAMES. PERIOD!!!
is that they should impose a ban on selling pre-owned games that are still being distributed.
like r-type final for ps2
only way i could get a hold of it was pre-owned because it wasnt a major release, so the period of distribution was quite short.
companies like EBgames and gamestop should buy the preowned games, then hold them out back until they are no longer getting new copies of that game in stock, then stock the shelves with the pre-owned copies.
they are only the people who go on the play-station store with cfw and almost none of my mates go on it and the have cfw.
11,078,484 psp owners
so every 110,000 users is 1%
you must have a hell of alot of friends to make that percentage move
i think wiirolled's estimation sounds correct
meaning theres 550,000 to 880,000 PSP's that have custom firmware
i know heaps of people who dont have custom firmware
and i will never put them onto CFW either because i know they wont use homebrew
they would only use it to pirate
Companies buy second hand games from the public and sell on for roughly 30-50% more than what they paid. There’s no guarantee that this stock will then sell. If a company buys 15 many copies of a used game for £20 and sells it on for £30 they would have to sell 10 of those copies to break even on the stock they bought.
it already exists and it is called Steam .
F*** me! $119.95 AU for CoD4!? That's about £60! I got Killzone 2 for less than half that (£29.49) new from play.com
Talk about getting shafted eh?
Man I hate it when people think that piracy was killing the industry you know that wasnt the case in the first place it was always used games and all you guys know it.... Man think about it Gamestop made over a Billion dollars in profit in the used games trade and I know that Gamestop keeps a good track of buying used games from kids and people alike they should give the developers of the games some of the profit buying in and selling out of used games part of it plain and simple and there you go problem solved!!!!! Oh FYI..... I have CFW on my PSP and I still buy from the PSN store so no Piracy isnt killing the industry its selling used games!!!!!!!
lol
yeah killzone 2 in on special offer at EBgames for only $109.95
shafted isnt the word
you can sell an A grade PS3 title for $20 AUD
look at http://www.ebgames.com.au/productSearch.cfm?category+2+platform+ps3+clear+
and have a look at the markup
plus signs change to equals