Posted Apr 08, 2006 at 01:29AM by Pranav T
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It has already been proven that the uClinux Proof Concept was actually fake. The problem with porting Linux to the PSP is the fact that the PSP's CPU is without a very vital unit known as the MMU - Memory Management Unit. While explaining its function would be out of the scope of this story, suffice to say that it's the main reason why its impractical to port Linux.
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LittleBigPlanet early copies unboxed
41 Comments
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» yeh but
nocomment
nocomment
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» damn stupid website
cut me off before i could make my comment. anyway what about bochs? i thought that could emulate linux
cut me off before i could make my comment. anyway what about bochs? i thought that could emulate linux
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» ...
who really cares, if u do it for the applications, just make a clone
who really cares, if u do it for the applications, just make a clone
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by cyanide - 2006-04-08 |
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» -
bochs is emulation...linux could run that way...but it would be even more useless..
running linux native, which is the dream, is almost impossible.
bochs is emulation...linux could run that way...but it would be even more useless..
running linux native, which is the dream, is almost impossible.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» Sad Sad Penguin
Aww this anonymous coward thinks that the penguin looks so sad in that picture...
Aww this anonymous coward thinks that the penguin looks so sad in that picture...
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» What PSPHacks.net will do for members...
It never seems to amaze me the extremes sites like psphacks.net will go to for members. :(
It never seems to amaze me the extremes sites like psphacks.net will go to for members. :(
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» .
Actually, a port of the linux kernel would be a great thing, because instead of being useless to everyone, we'd suddenly have a much easier way to write network clients.
Think: ftp client/server, IM/IRC client, music players, etc. -- do those things require fancy GUI interfaces to run? They all already exist for linux. If you can get the kernel running on the PSP and port over a C library, it's no longer necessary to jump through so many hoops to get things working. You can do all your development and testing on a linux machine using standard tools, and then cross-compile for PSP.
I'd love linux on the psp, because then I'd get flac audio support!
Actually, a port of the linux kernel would be a great thing, because instead of being useless to everyone, we'd suddenly have a much easier way to write network clients.
Think: ftp client/server, IM/IRC client, music players, etc. -- do those things require fancy GUI interfaces to run? They all already exist for linux. If you can get the kernel running on the PSP and port over a C library, it's no longer necessary to jump through so many hoops to get things working. You can do all your development and testing on a linux machine using standard tools, and then cross-compile for PSP.
I'd love linux on the psp, because then I'd get flac audio support!
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» PS2
Linux has been ported to PlayStation 2 as well, you can buy the disc to do that from Sony themselves.
Linux has been ported to PlayStation 2 as well, you can buy the disc to do that from Sony themselves.
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by Advertising - |
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by MrDaBucket - 2006-04-08 |
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» You can put Windows 95 and Mac OS7 on it.
Apperaently the same way you can put Linux on it.
It's just ree....e...a......l....l......y..y........s..l.l....oo..o.o....w...w.w..
That's all.
Link: http://www.hacker.co.il/psp/bochs/
Apperaently the same way you can put Linux on it.
It's just ree....e...a......l....l......y..y........s..l.l....oo..o.o....w...w.w..
That's all.
Link: http://www.hacker.co.il/psp/bochs/
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» Totally Wrong
Actually, you don't need an MMU to run uClinux. Take a look at the iPodLinux project (http://ipodlinux.org) where even though the iPod has an MMU, it is not featureful enough to be used by Linux, though they do have a running port. Not only that, they have a GUI (podzilla) that runs on top of that, with plugins for games with graphics, including a port of Doom! Better do more research before saying something is close to impossible. In fact it would run uClinux much better than the iPod because of the available memory and CPU speed, more than likely. I can't wait to see it run...
Actually, you don't need an MMU to run uClinux. Take a look at the iPodLinux project (http://ipodlinux.org) where even though the iPod has an MMU, it is not featureful enough to be used by Linux, though they do have a running port. Not only that, they have a GUI (podzilla) that runs on top of that, with plugins for games with graphics, including a port of Doom! Better do more research before saying something is close to impossible. In fact it would run uClinux much better than the iPod because of the available memory and CPU speed, more than likely. I can't wait to see it run...
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» Completely uninformed!
While it may or may not be factually correct that the proof of concept is fake, the explanation is just plain wrong. True, glibc, requires an MMU. True, most often the Linux kernel and other application are built on glibc. However, uClibc is a readily available glibc replacement specifically for microcontrollers lacking MMUs, and uCLinux is a Linux disribution based upon it. The lack of an MMU is definitely not the main barrier. Please do your research.
While it may or may not be factually correct that the proof of concept is fake, the explanation is just plain wrong. True, glibc, requires an MMU. True, most often the Linux kernel and other application are built on glibc. However, uClibc is a readily available glibc replacement specifically for microcontrollers lacking MMUs, and uCLinux is a Linux disribution based upon it. The lack of an MMU is definitely not the main barrier. Please do your research.
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by cyanide - 2006-04-08 |
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» -
the lack of mmu IS the main reason why it would be impractical.. I never said that it was difficult to port it because of that. Just that it wouldnt be very useful. Do a bit of proof-reading before actually going out and making a fool of yourself.
the lack of mmu IS the main reason why it would be impractical.. I never said that it was difficult to port it because of that. Just that it wouldnt be very useful. Do a bit of proof-reading before actually going out and making a fool of yourself.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» walk, then run
I think we should invent a keyboard before we start debating porting Linux.
I think we should invent a keyboard before we start debating porting Linux.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» The GBA has a uClinux port.
...The GBA doesn't have MMU support and uClinux has been ported to it.
...The GBA doesn't have MMU support and uClinux has been ported to it.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» I agree with #10
You are absolutely right, uClinux does not need an MMU. Because of this, I see no reason why linux would not run on psp. However, the iPod doesn't have a true MMU: it only has some MMU type facilities.
You are absolutely right, uClinux does not need an MMU. Because of this, I see no reason why linux would not run on psp. However, the iPod doesn't have a true MMU: it only has some MMU type facilities.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» iPodLinux vs. PSPLinux
To confirm what some othes are saying, iPodLinux does *not* use an MMU, and runs effectively. The power of uClinux on the PSP would be exponentially greater and could open up a vast range of applications, especially given the much larger screen real estate, greater speed, and much better interface capabilities.
To confirm what some othes are saying, iPodLinux does *not* use an MMU, and runs effectively. The power of uClinux on the PSP would be exponentially greater and could open up a vast range of applications, especially given the much larger screen real estate, greater speed, and much better interface capabilities.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» notitle
yep uClinux is no further away from the PSP than any other peice of hardware out there. Linux is way to versitale not to run on just about any hardware setup. So what if 90% of linux apps don't work, you can always write new ones. There is a reason why so many linux apps are compiled a thousand different ways for all the different distros anyways.
yep uClinux is no further away from the PSP than any other peice of hardware out there. Linux is way to versitale not to run on just about any hardware setup. So what if 90% of linux apps don't work, you can always write new ones. There is a reason why so many linux apps are compiled a thousand different ways for all the different distros anyways.
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by Advertising - |
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» linux ported
linux has already been ported to psp... goddamn do some research first n00bs!
i am teh anonymous coward
linux has already been ported to psp... goddamn do some research first n00bs!
i am teh anonymous coward
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by funetik - 2006-04-08 |
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» ?
"I'd love linux on the psp, because then I'd get flac audio support!"
I'm not a hardcore audiophile, but I appreciate quality equipment and sound. Just wondering why you'd use FLAC? The psp's audio isn't that impressive (I don't mean the thrown in headphones or built in speakers). Why waste a memory card on 1 album's worth of music? =/
"I'd love linux on the psp, because then I'd get flac audio support!"
I'm not a hardcore audiophile, but I appreciate quality equipment and sound. Just wondering why you'd use FLAC? The psp's audio isn't that impressive (I don't mean the thrown in headphones or built in speakers). Why waste a memory card on 1 album's worth of music? =/
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» PSP Linux == Useless
#7 - You mentioned that using a standard C library and tools to port to the PSP would be easier.
That's what we already do to code for PSP. Coding for the PSP is *very* similar to Linux coding. The C libraries are nearly identical and most developers do do development and some testing(using slightly customized program versions usually with different graphics and network backends) on PC before cross-compiling to PSP (which uses the standard gcc/binutils suite).
Linux on the PSP would have few advantages, especially since it wouldn't be "standard" anyway (you'd have to use uclibc and ucLinux because of the lack of an MMU)
#7 - You mentioned that using a standard C library and tools to port to the PSP would be easier.
That's what we already do to code for PSP. Coding for the PSP is *very* similar to Linux coding. The C libraries are nearly identical and most developers do do development and some testing(using slightly customized program versions usually with different graphics and network backends) on PC before cross-compiling to PSP (which uses the standard gcc/binutils suite).
Linux on the PSP would have few advantages, especially since it wouldn't be "standard" anyway (you'd have to use uclibc and ucLinux because of the lack of an MMU)
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» hmm..
The problem isn't the lack of an MMU, but the kernel running in the background on the PSP. Like it was explained in the article, for linux to work 'for real' on a psp, a bootloader would need to be programmed and put onto the flash memory... Ie you would have to fool the firmware into reading files off the mem stick. I don't think anyone is prepared to risk bricking a psp trying to run a modifyed firmware.
It's possible linux could be emulated, but even if it was it would be impossibly slow (like Win 95 was in Bochs). Actually it's theoretically possible that both the OS's could run on the PSP 'for real' at a decent speed, the hard part would be writing custom drivers, and of course modifying the firmware.
The problem isn't the lack of an MMU, but the kernel running in the background on the PSP. Like it was explained in the article, for linux to work 'for real' on a psp, a bootloader would need to be programmed and put onto the flash memory... Ie you would have to fool the firmware into reading files off the mem stick. I don't think anyone is prepared to risk bricking a psp trying to run a modifyed firmware.
It's possible linux could be emulated, but even if it was it would be impossibly slow (like Win 95 was in Bochs). Actually it's theoretically possible that both the OS's could run on the PSP 'for real' at a decent speed, the hard part would be writing custom drivers, and of course modifying the firmware.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» ssh
all we need is an SSH client. The peldet code would be a good starting point for some sort of putty type ssh client.
all we need is an SSH client. The peldet code would be a good starting point for some sort of putty type ssh client.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» ...
!!!! The whole point of uClinux is to be able to run Linux on non-MMU archs! How stupid can people get?
!!!! The whole point of uClinux is to be able to run Linux on non-MMU archs! How stupid can people get?
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by Vipre77 - 2006-04-08 |
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» one in a million chance?
Sounds like a lack of dedication...
Sounds like a lack of dedication...
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» You know admin...
I think these people think you actually were writing this program...LMAO. I mean all you do is come here and reinterate what someles said, and all of a sudden it's all your fault ?!?! I mean if YOU people know so much, why aren't YOU doing something, oh yah, I forgot you would rather sit there and b***h and moan like a bunch of spoiled brats. Sad man , sad !!!!
No, I'm not an a**kisser, I just thinks it's a little childish how you people handle yourselves in here. If YOU did your research like you say the admin DIDN'T then obviously it'd have to be a little more detailed , right? Again, sad, just sad. You're lucky you even get to come in here and post at all you lil f****ts.
I think these people think you actually were writing this program...LMAO. I mean all you do is come here and reinterate what someles said, and all of a sudden it's all your fault ?!?! I mean if YOU people know so much, why aren't YOU doing something, oh yah, I forgot you would rather sit there and b***h and moan like a bunch of spoiled brats. Sad man , sad !!!!
No, I'm not an a**kisser, I just thinks it's a little childish how you people handle yourselves in here. If YOU did your research like you say the admin DIDN'T then obviously it'd have to be a little more detailed , right? Again, sad, just sad. You're lucky you even get to come in here and post at all you lil f****ts.
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» #25
wtf?
wtf?
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-08 |
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» ...
COUGH bochs COUGH
COUGH bochs COUGH
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-09 |
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» Gotta love this site
I was going to point out the glaring errors made in this story but thankfully others have done it for me :)
If only this site got some decent writers!
I was going to point out the glaring errors made in this story but thankfully others have done it for me :)
If only this site got some decent writers!
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by Casablanca Gamer - 2006-04-09 |
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» fakes
Now fakes come from France too...
Now fakes come from France too...
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by Anonymous Coward (Unregistered) - 2006-04-10 |
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» Where is the proof that this is fake?
FTA: "It has already been proven that the uClinux Proof Concept was actually fake."
Link to the proof that it's fake. Since you didn't do any research anyways on the whole mmu topic, it would seem that this story is an attempt to poke fun at psphacks.net since that is where the ucLinux story originated.
FTA: "It has already been proven that the uClinux Proof Concept was actually fake."
Link to the proof that it's fake. Since you didn't do any research anyways on the whole mmu topic, it would seem that this story is an attempt to poke fun at psphacks.net since that is where the ucLinux story originated.
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